Logbot (Nov 22 2024 at 22:35): Logbot (Nov 22 2024 at 22:35):Our friends Johannes Schlickling & James Long join us to discuss the movement of local-first, its pros and cons, the tradeoffs, and the path to the warming waters of mostly local apps. :link: https://changelog.com/friends/71
| Ch | Start | Title | Runs |
|---|---|---|---|
| 01 | 00:00 | Let's talk! | 00:40 |
| 02 | 00:40 | Sponsor: Fly.io | 02:32 |
| 03 | 03:12 | Meet our friends | 02:23 |
| 04 | 05:34 | Defining local-first | 04:01 |
| 05 | 09:36 | Why go local-first? | 16:36 |
| 06 | 26:12 | Sponsor: Timescale | 02:17 |
| 07 | 28:29 | Sponsor: Eight Sleep | 02:32 |
| 08 | 31:01 | What are the tradeoffs? | 15:09 |
| 09 | 46:10 | Fighting the browser | 02:41 |
| 10 | 48:51 | Overtone.pro | 07:35 |
| 11 | 56:26 | Sponsor: WorkOS | 02:50 |
| 12 | 59:16 | How warm are local-first waters? | 11:42 |
| 13 | 1:10:59 | Apple notes is less local-first | 05:59 |
| 14 | 1:16:57 | The future for "mostly" local | 13:35 |
| 15 | 1:30:32 | Listen to localfirst.fm | 01:38 |
| 16 | 1:32:10 | Closing thoughts and stuff | 01:28 |
Tim Uckun (Nov 26 2024 at 20:27):The problem I see is that you are using the world "local" differently than me. You say local is local to the machine but I say local is local to me. This means it's local no matter what machine I am on. My laptop, my desktop, my phone, my wife's desktop etc. I want my data to be there ready and waiting for me.
Clearly what is needed it a distributed database that is individualized somehow with a shared component.
Daniel Buckmaster (Nov 26 2024 at 20:31):It seems like most local first projects use a sync engine to ensure different devices share data. The point though is that the sync engine is "optional" or at least resilient to network outage.
The Automerge folks were even talking about a completely app-agnostic sync protocol, so any local first app could use commodity syncing backend that doesn't know anything about specific apps. https://www.localfirst.fm/4
Matthew Sanabria (Nov 28 2024 at 05:27):I like the "mostly local" terminology personally. Local first always felt wrong because most applications are remote (cloud) first.
Sukhdeep Brar (Nov 29 2024 at 00:48):I think that is the key distinctiono with local first. The local experience should be optimized. It's more about not being online online. (Not is it about being local only).
A lot of apps are developed cloud first, and the after thought is the "you're offline" banner. I, personally, welcome our local first overlords.
Matthew Sanabria (Dec 01 2024 at 04:04):I agree with the sentiment but by that definition it's still cloud first and local afterthought.
Daniel Buckmaster (Dec 01 2024 at 22:21):Matthew Sanabria said:
Local first always felt wrong because most applications are remote (cloud) first.
It's fine for those remote-first apps to not be called local-first ;). I think it's important that the local-first term is quite strong, because there actually is a big difference. If you have a cloud app that works well-enough when the network is patchy, that's great. But it's not the same thing!
Last updated: Jan 06 2025 at 01:13 UTC